Author Topic: Mouse tails wanted  (Read 498 times)

Offline Carolyn (Kim) King

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Mouse tails wanted
« on: November 19, 2008, 09:33:51 AM »
Hi guys, attached please find a recent paper on the origins of mice in NZ. I'm keen to extend the rather limited collection of samples used for this preliminary survey. The simplest method is to set up a system of collecting dried mouse tails, which can be stored singly in small envelopes marked with date and origin, and sent to me through the post. If anyone is interested in helping, I'd love to hear from you at c.king@waikato.ac.nz. Dont send anything in yest, till I get organised - at this stage I'm just interested to see how much interest there might be, especially in remote places and inshore islands (Ruapuke I. is high on my list). Thanks! Kim

Offline Dave Houston

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Re: Mouse tails wanted
« Reply #1 on: November 19, 2008, 09:58:24 AM »
Hi Carolyn and welcome aboard!  Interesting paper - do you want any more Chatham and Pitt Island samples and if so then how many are useful - one or two or dozens?

Offline Carolyn (Kim) King

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Re: Mouse tails wanted
« Reply #2 on: November 19, 2008, 10:52:27 AM »
Hi Dave, yes certainly some more samples from Chatham and Pitt would be very welcome. Especially any historical information about how long mice have been on Pitt. The DNA of the few mice we got from there are consistent with the idea that they could have arrived from Sydney in 1827 with a pre-colonial sealing wreck, the Glory, but other sources suggest mice have not been there that long. Can you find out more for me about that? Also, we've been puzzling about the Asian mice on main Chatham - the paper suggests they could have come off the Randolph in 1853, but Asian fishing vessels have visited there many times since then. I'd be so grateful for any ideas you might have, thanks. K.

Offline Euan Kennedy

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Re: Mouse tails wanted
« Reply #3 on: June 10, 2009, 01:52:31 PM »
Hello Carolyn

I can't help you with mouse tails from Pitt Island but I can offer you some mouse tales. I would value your comments.

In the course of researching the likely extirpation date of black robins on Pitt Island for my doctoral study, I've consulted much old literature and some old Pitt Islanders. The conclusion I've drawn so far is that mice did not arrive on Pitt Island until after 1867 (see below). By this time, Frederick Hunt had been farming on the island for ~ 25 years. He had developed 240 acres of clearings comprising English grasses in what was otherwise a fully forested island.

You would consider it a very high probability that Hunt had introduced mice accidentally with his grass seed. But in his account of his Chathams expedition, H. H. Travers (1868: 178) appears very careful to say that mice were on Chatham Island at that time but not on Pitt Island. Wild cats were in abundance on both. Travers used Pitt as his base and resided with the Hunt family for many months, so if mice (and black robins) had been on Pitt Island at that time, he is sure to have encountered them. 

Fast forward to 1900. I asked Bill Carter, Pitt Island descendant and author of the farming histories of Pitt, Rangatira and Mangere Islands (in press), what he knew of mice arrival on the island. He told me that Pitt Island was mouse-free until about 1900, when a 'pregnant' mouse was seen to escape from a bag of flour unloaded from a supply ship at Flower Pot.

This is anecdote of course but the small Pitt Island community holds fast to heritage stories of this kind. How the locals understood the mouse to be pregnant is not explained, though perhaps the subsequent appearance of lots of mice gave rise to inference.  I'm sure a search of letters and diaries of the time might corroborate this story if a noteworthy explosion in mouse numbers followed first arrival. If you accept Bill's story, then the departure points for Pitt Island supply vessels of that time might also throw some light on the origins of the mice. Less reliable I suppose than molecular analyses.

From this threadbare information, I've concluded that mice arrived on Pitt Island after 1867 and perhaps not before 1900. What the wild cats were eating in the meantime is a mystery. According to newspaper accounts from the late 1880s and early 1900s, their densities on Pitt were legendarily high.  Assuming that they arrived with the first sealers and whalers (c. 1800), they must surely have cleaned out most available avian prey.

I would certainly appreciate your comments on this. If mice did arrive on the Glory in 1827, then I'm less able to say that cats alone extirpated the robins on the island.

Regards


Offline Carolyn (Kim) King

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Re: Mouse tails wanted
« Reply #4 on: June 10, 2009, 03:58:59 PM »
Dear Euan, many thanks for taking the trouble to send me this. Yes it certainly fills in a few de-tails. Looks like the Glory connection was too long a shot - I agree, if mice had been there since 1827, someone would have noticed them before 1900. If ever you do find out anything about the routes taken by the Pitt supply ships of the time, that would be very valuable additional info. Surely the most obvious assumption is that they came from the mainland, went to Chatham first and then to Pitt. In which case, maybe the present Pitt mice represent the original mice on Chatham, which have since been replaced by the Asian subspecies now present there, perhaps from fishing vessels. Problem will be to find a way of figuring out if it really did happen that way! We are beginning to collect samples from the Oamaru area for a new study trying to pin down the location of the predicted hybrid zone between European and Asian mice in the southern SI, but dont at the moment plan to extend that study to the islands. Still, any info about the history of mice in NZ is of interest, thanks. Kim King.

Offline Euan Kennedy

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Re: Mouse tails wanted
« Reply #5 on: June 13, 2009, 11:19:55 PM »
Kim

I gather you have been corresponding with Bill Carter. I spoke with him tonight about departure points for Chatham Island and Pitt Island supply vessels. He has a good understanding of which vessels of which nationality came from which ports, and when. Because my notes do not do his knowledge justice, I think it best that you speak with him directly when you have time.

Regards

Euan

Offline Carolyn (Kim) King

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Re: Mouse tails wanted
« Reply #6 on: June 14, 2009, 03:47:39 PM »
Actually, no - I dont know Bill Carter, or any Chathams locals, so I'd be grateful if you could put me in touch, thanks. Most of my info, such as I have,  comes from marine historian Rhys Richards. Kim